DGUTS - Don't Give Up The Ship, By Arneson, Gygax & Carr

[Havard]

First published in 1972 by Guidon Games, this naval strategy game by Dave Arneson, Gary Gygax and Mike Carr was the first publication involving both Arneson and Gygax. This page at the Collector's Trove has some pictures of Co-Creator Mike Carr teaching the game to a group.

According to this thread at the OD&D74 Forum, Arneson had intended to bring the game back in 2008:

DGUTS will be re-released by GHQ this summer. No, no RPG in it.
There were actually three editions. Two by GUIDON games and one by TSR.

Dave Arneson

and later:

OK here is the latest. Stillwaiting for a publication opening at GHQ. "Real soon now">

There will be PDF files for all single ship actions in the American Revolution, French Revolution, Napoleonic Wars and, of course, The war of 1812. These are based primarily on a six volume set of NAVAL HISTORY OF GREAT BRITIAN by James.

There are also a set of Campaign rules which I am testing next month. And finially their was a set of "Privateer" rules based on the AWI where each player has a ship, goes raiding, and progress up the command ladder based on how well they do. Pretty well tested but needs anther run through. That's about as close to RPG as DGTS gets.

Dave Arneson
"Dark Lord of Gaming"

Does anyone know more about the game? Is it true that some of the mechanics used in DGUTS were also used in the Blackmoor Campaign?

-Havard

[gsvenson]

I still have my copy (one of the Guidon Games versions). I enjoyed it allot. I have a box of hand painted little metal ships to use with it. I don't see that the mechanics would have been used in D&D, other then the concepts of rolling D6's for combat results and moral. Maybe I don't see it from a high enough level...

[finarvyn]

I actually have two copies -- one of the Guidon version and one of the TSR version -- and they are very similar.

I bought them because (1) they were a Dave/Gary collaboration, and (2) I thought that maybe there would be an OD&D connection in the same way that Chainmail is somewhat connected to OD&D.

Like Greg, I don't really see that DGUTS has much in common with the naval rules from OD&D, but unlike Greg I've never really played the game so maybe my perspective is skewed as well.

[Havard]

According to something Aldarron posted in this thread at the OD&D74 Forum, the Armor Class mechanic first appeared in a game Dave Arneson was working on called Civil War Ironclads. The game was never published, but I heard some rumours that this system was also used in DGUTS?

I have ordered a copy of DGUTS, but am still waiting for it to arrive...

-Havard

[gsvenson]

I never played the ironclad game, although I have seen others play it. So, I am not familiar with the mechanics. DGUTS doesn't have anything like armor classes, though.

[Havard]

I never played the ironclad game, although I have seen others play it. So, I am not familiar with the mechanics. DGUTS doesn't have anything like armor classes, though.

Thanks! I am still waiting for my copy of DGUTS to arrive. I wonder if there could be any links between that and Blackmoor. Although it looks less likely now.

-Havard

[finarvyn]

No real connection that I've noticed. DGUTS is mostly historical ship combat, and I never saw any real similarity between it and fantasy gaming. Believe me, I wanted to find something....

[Havard]

Finally got my hands on this one. I wish Arneson had compiled a "fantasy" supplement to DGUTS, similar to the Fantasy Supplement in Chainmail. At least two sea battles are mentioned in the FFC. One is between the fleet of Blackmoor and Sea Monsters. I wonder which rules were used to handle these situations?

-Havard

[finarvyn]

My understanding is that Dave's "house rules" were used for all naval actions. I've never seen any mention that DGUTS was used for anything Blackmoor.

[gsvenson]

At least two sea battles are mentioned in the FFC. One is between the fleet of Blackmoor and Sea Monsters. I wonder which rules were used to handle these situations?

I don't remember for sure, but it might have been Trireme.