01-05-2010, 11:50 AM
http://mmrpg.zeitgeistgames.com/index.p ... opic&t=540
Havard:
I made a regional map for Blackmoor:
http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.p ... st11120738
Post your comments there or here. Let me know what you think?
EDIT: Direct link to the map itself here: http://www.pandius.com/BlackmoorRegionalMap.jpg
******************
Rafael:
WOAH, BABY! Great! Plus, matches almost totally with my vision of linking both settings!
:applause:
:applause:
:applause:
**************
Havard:
Thanks! Thats great to hear Smile
I used the Pre-Cataclysmic map of Mystara as a basis for the coastlines, but modified it slightly to fit with the more specific coastal features of Blackmoor and also the area around the Wilderlands. I am planning on expanding it further south to include the entire Wilderlands, the Demon Empires(Wilderlands) and the lands of the Tanogoro(Mystara). Also, there are a few more Thonian provinces to include. I don't have names for those though. Are there any maps of Greyhawk's Great Kingdom availabla online BTW?
******************
Lkj:
There was someone on the Necromancer Wilderlands board asking about just such a map. I linked your map (very cool by the way) for him. Hope that's all right. Here's the relevant thread if you want to put in your two cents:
http://p105.ezboard.com/Blackmoor/fnecr ... =405.topic
AD
*************
bgilkison:
Pre- or post-Greyhawk Wars? There's the above at the following: http://www.highprogrammer.com/alan/gami ... index.html, but it doesn't go into great detail specifically on the Great Kingdom (both maps cover the entire Flanaess).
If you have or can get access to Campaign Cartographer, there are some maps associated with the unpublished Ivid the Undying manuscript at the Canonfire! website: http://www.canonfire.com/cfhtml/modules ... oad&cid=15
The entire text of Ivid the Undying is also available on Canonfire! at http://www.canonfire.com/cfhtml/modules ... tit&lid=29 . It is set post-Greyhawk Wars, so I'm not sure if it will have the older province names, but it might be worth a perusal...
******************
Hey, that's great! Its nice to have this thing spread to those who may have an interest in the map.
Plus, it adds to my geekly fame Wink
Cheers,
Havard
********************
Havard:
I have decided to expand the map, incorporating the entire Wilderlands setting.
EXPANDED BLACKMOOR REGIONAL MAP:
http://www.pandius.com/BlackmoorRegionalMapWL.jpg
Comments? Smile
************************
Rafael:
As soon as I find the time, I'll post some suggestions for the GK provinces...
As to Greyhawk, two are simply named North Province and South Province, IIRC.
In any case, Harv, you will have the honour to be *printed out and painted over and over* in my next Blackmoor session. Smile Errh, your map, of course...
********************
Havard:
Cool Cool
I just made a few minor modifications to the Expanded map. Make sure you get the latest version.
Also, notice that from the very first map, I have moved the Province of Bolgerie south west. It should be close to the Tanagoro realms, since both the Bolgers and the Tanagoro are based on RW African cultures.
Havard
***************
Sheridan:
It's my Ancient Mystara setting - exactly the way I had always pictured it - AWESOME!
********************
Havard:
Thats great Smile
I have been paying attention to online discussions about combining the three settings for some time and I have tried to be mindful of the points I have come across, including yours. I'm happy that most people seem to be okay with it.
For me it was really useful to get the thing visualized.
Havard
********************
Rafael:
Smile Seriously, Harv, this might be the best fan contribution to my games in years.
************************
Havard:
Thanks buddy, you are too kind! Smile
Let me know how the printing goes. The map is optimised for web use, so if you need a version with better resolution, I can probably hook you up with one.
Havard
*********************
The Wondering Bard:
I like the map!! It kicks butt!!
******************
Shane:
Havard, I was wondering why you're considering using the Great Kingdom as a source for Thonia. Were the two realms synonymous in Arneson's and Gygax's original Blackmoor/Greyhawk campaigns?
Travis
*********************
Shane:
Oh, I found the thread where Thonia=Great Kingdom was discussed:
http://www.dablackmoor.com/MMRPG/index. ... 7&start=15
I wonder how Greyhawk's Great Kingdom of Aerdy can be melded into Blackmoor's Great Kingdom of Thonia for Mystara?
My first thought is to match up the timelines of Arneson's and Gygax's original campaigns to find the extent (i.e. the geographic borders) of the Gygax's Great Kingdom at the time of classic Blackmoor. I mean, what year(s) (in both Blackmoor's timeline and Oerth's timeline) did Svenny traveled from Blackmoor to Aerdy and back? Whatever date this was can then be equated. Then, whatever the Great Kingdom was like at this time can be used for Thonia. Of course there would need to be some adapting of the shape of the Great Kingdom to fit eastern Skothar*. Also, some equations would need to be made as far as names of places, people, and other Greyhawk elements (e.g. "Aerdy" = "Thonia"?).
*Unless the lands of the Great Kingdom of this time (but not of the rest of the Flanaess or Oerth) were simply attached to the map southeast of Blackmoor and Karnak so that the Great Kingdom replaces eastern Skothar, kind of like James Mishler's "Mystaroerth" map. I don't know what's best though.
Travis
P.S. I wonder if any of the long-timers who played with Arneson and Gygax have any more ideas of how the two Great Kingdoms were correlated?
*************************
Gsvenson:
I am woefully ignorant of Oerth's timeline and of whatever was officially published about Greyhawk. Svenny and his family traveled to the Great Kingdom (in the summer of 1972 real time) to sell Elven magic items collected for his friends among the Cumasti Elves. That was the official explanation for when I was out of town for about three months and therefore not active in the game. So, I didn't gain any knowledge of the Great Kingdom at that time. Later all of the heroes of the North travelled accross the Great Kingdom to Greyhawk, where Gary's players had gotten into a bad way and we were able to save them from their crisis, but we traveled on tarnback and didn't really have a specific adventure during the trip. Other players crossed between the two campaigns by moving from Lake Geneva to Minneapolis and vice versa, so they might have different and more interesting stories then mine.
**********************
Shane:
Wow, that's interesting. Thanks for responding.
Do you know of any other places that existed (perhaps under different names) in both Arneson's and Gygax's original campaigns, besides Blackmoor, Ten/Tenh, and Thonia/Aerdy?
For those who aren't familiar with James Mishler's combined Oerik/Skothar map, here's a link: http://pandius.com/mystghmp.jpg
James has one of the oldest Mystara home campaigns, and his company owns a license to publish new Wilderlands products.
A melding of Gygax's and Arneson's settings on Mystara might look something like this map, though there's several other possible configurations.
*************************
Havard:
I like James' map and I really wish I was able to replicate that style myself.
I was considering stealing elements from Greyhawk's Great Kingdom, but I wouldn't take things too far. It is my impression that Greyhawk is quite different from Blackmoor, which IMO fits better with the Wilderlands that with GH.
James' map fit GH onto modern Mystara ofcourse, which doesn't help me much since my Blackmoor is placed on Ancient Mystara.
Likewise, the Blackmoor of Greyhawk seems to be quite different from the real Blackmoor, so elements would be stolen, but an exact copy would be taking it too far.
My own idea of Thonia is also that of a more Byzantian or Conan-esque realm, filled with exotic beauty, decadence and corruption. I don't know how well that fits with the GH version.
Havard
**************************
Gsvenson:
I remember you talking about Tarns earlier Greg, and I have been wondering: How common or available were these creatures in Dave's campaign? I have been thinking about giving Blackmoor a small number of Great Eagles or similar flying creatures manned by a small unit in the service of the king. How appropriate would that be do you think? I'm interested in other peoples comments as well.
What flying creatures could be used by the enemies of Blackmoor if any?
*************************
Finarvyn:
Very nice expanded map, Havard! I had seen your early version, but not the one that ties into the Wilderlands campaign.
Well done! Very Happy
_________________
Finarvyn
Warden of Blackmoor
Earl of Stone Creek (Castles & Crusades Society)
D&D Player Since 1975
Original D&D Discussion
Delete this post
***********************
Havard:
Thanks Fin! Smile
I have more maps in the works. If you poke around on the Wayfarer's Inn, you might find more as well... Smile
Havard
********************
Rafe:
Ahem, Look for Rafe's Tavern on the maps, ahem! Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
**********************
Havard:
The best Tavern in the Multiverse! Smile
******************
Rafe:
Many thanks, my friend! But: Oooh, don't force me to write a description...
I can clearly picture chef Havard and barmaiden Fin already...
************************
Havard:
Actually, a description would be neat. But I assume Fin would probably prefer not being turned into a maiden... Laughing
*******************
Rafe:
Give me a few days, and I'll look if I can hammer out a concept. Smile
***************
-Havard
Havard:
I made a regional map for Blackmoor:
http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.p ... st11120738
Post your comments there or here. Let me know what you think?
EDIT: Direct link to the map itself here: http://www.pandius.com/BlackmoorRegionalMap.jpg
******************
Rafael:
WOAH, BABY! Great! Plus, matches almost totally with my vision of linking both settings!
:applause:
:applause:
:applause:
**************
Havard:
Thanks! Thats great to hear Smile
I used the Pre-Cataclysmic map of Mystara as a basis for the coastlines, but modified it slightly to fit with the more specific coastal features of Blackmoor and also the area around the Wilderlands. I am planning on expanding it further south to include the entire Wilderlands, the Demon Empires(Wilderlands) and the lands of the Tanogoro(Mystara). Also, there are a few more Thonian provinces to include. I don't have names for those though. Are there any maps of Greyhawk's Great Kingdom availabla online BTW?
******************
Lkj:
There was someone on the Necromancer Wilderlands board asking about just such a map. I linked your map (very cool by the way) for him. Hope that's all right. Here's the relevant thread if you want to put in your two cents:
http://p105.ezboard.com/Blackmoor/fnecr ... =405.topic
AD
*************
bgilkison:
Pre- or post-Greyhawk Wars? There's the above at the following: http://www.highprogrammer.com/alan/gami ... index.html, but it doesn't go into great detail specifically on the Great Kingdom (both maps cover the entire Flanaess).
If you have or can get access to Campaign Cartographer, there are some maps associated with the unpublished Ivid the Undying manuscript at the Canonfire! website: http://www.canonfire.com/cfhtml/modules ... oad&cid=15
The entire text of Ivid the Undying is also available on Canonfire! at http://www.canonfire.com/cfhtml/modules ... tit&lid=29 . It is set post-Greyhawk Wars, so I'm not sure if it will have the older province names, but it might be worth a perusal...
******************
Hey, that's great! Its nice to have this thing spread to those who may have an interest in the map.
Plus, it adds to my geekly fame Wink
Cheers,
Havard
********************
Havard:
I have decided to expand the map, incorporating the entire Wilderlands setting.
EXPANDED BLACKMOOR REGIONAL MAP:
http://www.pandius.com/BlackmoorRegionalMapWL.jpg
Comments? Smile
************************
Rafael:
As soon as I find the time, I'll post some suggestions for the GK provinces...
As to Greyhawk, two are simply named North Province and South Province, IIRC.
In any case, Harv, you will have the honour to be *printed out and painted over and over* in my next Blackmoor session. Smile Errh, your map, of course...
********************
Havard:
Cool Cool
I just made a few minor modifications to the Expanded map. Make sure you get the latest version.
Also, notice that from the very first map, I have moved the Province of Bolgerie south west. It should be close to the Tanagoro realms, since both the Bolgers and the Tanagoro are based on RW African cultures.
Havard
***************
Sheridan:
It's my Ancient Mystara setting - exactly the way I had always pictured it - AWESOME!
********************
Havard:
Thats great Smile
I have been paying attention to online discussions about combining the three settings for some time and I have tried to be mindful of the points I have come across, including yours. I'm happy that most people seem to be okay with it.
For me it was really useful to get the thing visualized.
Havard
********************
Rafael:
Smile Seriously, Harv, this might be the best fan contribution to my games in years.
************************
Havard:
Thanks buddy, you are too kind! Smile
Let me know how the printing goes. The map is optimised for web use, so if you need a version with better resolution, I can probably hook you up with one.
Havard
*********************
The Wondering Bard:
I like the map!! It kicks butt!!
******************
Shane:
Havard, I was wondering why you're considering using the Great Kingdom as a source for Thonia. Were the two realms synonymous in Arneson's and Gygax's original Blackmoor/Greyhawk campaigns?
Travis
*********************
Shane:
Oh, I found the thread where Thonia=Great Kingdom was discussed:
http://www.dablackmoor.com/MMRPG/index. ... 7&start=15
I wonder how Greyhawk's Great Kingdom of Aerdy can be melded into Blackmoor's Great Kingdom of Thonia for Mystara?
My first thought is to match up the timelines of Arneson's and Gygax's original campaigns to find the extent (i.e. the geographic borders) of the Gygax's Great Kingdom at the time of classic Blackmoor. I mean, what year(s) (in both Blackmoor's timeline and Oerth's timeline) did Svenny traveled from Blackmoor to Aerdy and back? Whatever date this was can then be equated. Then, whatever the Great Kingdom was like at this time can be used for Thonia. Of course there would need to be some adapting of the shape of the Great Kingdom to fit eastern Skothar*. Also, some equations would need to be made as far as names of places, people, and other Greyhawk elements (e.g. "Aerdy" = "Thonia"?).
*Unless the lands of the Great Kingdom of this time (but not of the rest of the Flanaess or Oerth) were simply attached to the map southeast of Blackmoor and Karnak so that the Great Kingdom replaces eastern Skothar, kind of like James Mishler's "Mystaroerth" map. I don't know what's best though.
Travis
P.S. I wonder if any of the long-timers who played with Arneson and Gygax have any more ideas of how the two Great Kingdoms were correlated?
*************************
Gsvenson:
I am woefully ignorant of Oerth's timeline and of whatever was officially published about Greyhawk. Svenny and his family traveled to the Great Kingdom (in the summer of 1972 real time) to sell Elven magic items collected for his friends among the Cumasti Elves. That was the official explanation for when I was out of town for about three months and therefore not active in the game. So, I didn't gain any knowledge of the Great Kingdom at that time. Later all of the heroes of the North travelled accross the Great Kingdom to Greyhawk, where Gary's players had gotten into a bad way and we were able to save them from their crisis, but we traveled on tarnback and didn't really have a specific adventure during the trip. Other players crossed between the two campaigns by moving from Lake Geneva to Minneapolis and vice versa, so they might have different and more interesting stories then mine.
Quote:Shane wrote:The Great Kingdom was one and the same in both campaigns, as the two campaigns were connected. Dave and Gary collaborated.
P.S. I wonder if any of the long-timers who played with Arneson and Gygax have any more ideas of how the two Great Kingdoms were correlated?
**********************
Shane:
Wow, that's interesting. Thanks for responding.
Do you know of any other places that existed (perhaps under different names) in both Arneson's and Gygax's original campaigns, besides Blackmoor, Ten/Tenh, and Thonia/Aerdy?
For those who aren't familiar with James Mishler's combined Oerik/Skothar map, here's a link: http://pandius.com/mystghmp.jpg
James has one of the oldest Mystara home campaigns, and his company owns a license to publish new Wilderlands products.
A melding of Gygax's and Arneson's settings on Mystara might look something like this map, though there's several other possible configurations.
*************************
Havard:
I like James' map and I really wish I was able to replicate that style myself.
I was considering stealing elements from Greyhawk's Great Kingdom, but I wouldn't take things too far. It is my impression that Greyhawk is quite different from Blackmoor, which IMO fits better with the Wilderlands that with GH.
James' map fit GH onto modern Mystara ofcourse, which doesn't help me much since my Blackmoor is placed on Ancient Mystara.
Likewise, the Blackmoor of Greyhawk seems to be quite different from the real Blackmoor, so elements would be stolen, but an exact copy would be taking it too far.
My own idea of Thonia is also that of a more Byzantian or Conan-esque realm, filled with exotic beauty, decadence and corruption. I don't know how well that fits with the GH version.
Havard
**************************
Gsvenson:
I remember you talking about Tarns earlier Greg, and I have been wondering: How common or available were these creatures in Dave's campaign? I have been thinking about giving Blackmoor a small number of Great Eagles or similar flying creatures manned by a small unit in the service of the king. How appropriate would that be do you think? I'm interested in other peoples comments as well.
What flying creatures could be used by the enemies of Blackmoor if any?
*************************
Finarvyn:
Very nice expanded map, Havard! I had seen your early version, but not the one that ties into the Wilderlands campaign.
Well done! Very Happy
_________________
Finarvyn
Warden of Blackmoor
Earl of Stone Creek (Castles & Crusades Society)
D&D Player Since 1975
Original D&D Discussion
Delete this post
***********************
Havard:
Thanks Fin! Smile
I have more maps in the works. If you poke around on the Wayfarer's Inn, you might find more as well... Smile
Havard
********************
Rafe:
Ahem, Look for Rafe's Tavern on the maps, ahem! Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
**********************
Havard:
The best Tavern in the Multiverse! Smile
******************
Rafe:
Many thanks, my friend! But: Oooh, don't force me to write a description...
I can clearly picture chef Havard and barmaiden Fin already...
************************
Havard:
Actually, a description would be neat. But I assume Fin would probably prefer not being turned into a maiden... Laughing
*******************
Rafe:
Give me a few days, and I'll look if I can hammer out a concept. Smile
***************
-Havard
Currently Running: The Blackmoor Vales Saga
Currently Playing: Daniel S. Debelfry in the Throne of Star's Campaign
Currently Playing: Daniel S. Debelfry in the Throne of Star's Campaign