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Humans of Blackmoor? - Freedom92 - 07-11-2013

I know the majority of Blackmoors human inhabitants are of Thonian blood as well as peshwah but what else? I know there were other ethnicities floating about on other continents most likely, were they interactive with Blackmoor? Obvious answer would be the inclusion of the races of the Wilderlands but I'm thinking of stuff that were directly influenced.

So far I know of the:
Peshwah
Thonions
Valemen
Skhandhik/Sea Reavers(I cant remember how you spell it really)
Afridhi

What real life cultures could make their parallels? I want to flesh them out well enough my players understand their rituals an d customs. Mind telling me of any other human groups and what they could be compared too?

Re: Humans of Blackmoor? - RobJN - 07-11-2013

The extreme south of the Great Empire lies the Tangor Peninsula, according to Mystara's planetary map, so you would most likely have Tangoro thrown into the mix, as well. I believe Real World Africa was used for their inspiration, at least the Hollow World writeup. I know there was some discussion about the culture and various cultural flavor distinctions on the Piazza forums some time back...

Looking across the Yannifar Sea, directly west of Skothar, there would be the native Yannivey/Yannifey on the proto-continent that will (eventually) become Alphatia. Again, some discussion about possible RW cultural influences at the Piazza.

As you can see, my take assumes a "Mystara's Blackmoor" approach. Unfortunately, I don't know enough about the "pure" roots of the setting (Arneson's original incarnation) or the Greyhawked incarnation to be of any help there....

Re: Humans of Blackmoor? - gsvenson - 07-11-2013

I think of the American Indians when I think of the Peshwah.

I think of the Vikings when I think of the Skandaharians.

Thonians are generic Europeans.

I am afraid that I don't have a good reference point for the other human races to share with you.

Re: Humans of Blackmoor? - Freedom92 - 07-14-2013

I kind of got the gypsy feel from the peshwah and kind of played that up, the peshwah don't usually seem to make settlements and with their way of following the horses they have that feel to me as some of the best horse breeders as well.

I've heard the Afridha being described similar to vikings but also similar to middle eastern cultures, what is it? Also noticed the most info regarding their majority of info said the one player who played the high priestess was also in the Tekumel group which also made me think more middle eastern.

Also since the Tangaroo and Oltecs were around this era as well where would they be located? Actively encountering Blackmoor or in their own little world with their own little wars?

Also is there any middle eastern style cultures in Blackmoor/Mystara? What other cultural examples can anyone suggest?

Re: Humans of Blackmoor? - Havard - 07-15-2013

The Peshwa have been compared both to native americans as well as Scythians or Sarmatians. Unlike thd native americans of the old west the Peshwa have been known tl use metal armor and swords or scimitars. Diffent tribes could have different cultural traits too. One tribe is indeed similar to gypsies/Rom.

-Havard

Re: Humans of Blackmoor? - Havard - 07-17-2013

RobJN Wrote:As you can see, my take assumes a "Mystara's Blackmoor" approach. Unfortunately, I don't know enough about the "pure" roots of the setting (Arneson's original incarnation) or the Greyhawked incarnation to be of any help there....

While Tangor/Tanagoro is a Mystara term, a dark skinned people known to the Thonians as Bolgers are described in the DA modules. While many of the Bolgers are citizens of the Thonian Empire, I would also assume that others are natives to Dave Arneson's Jungle Realm, mentioned in the FFC.

-Havard

Re: Humans of Blackmoor? - Havard - 07-18-2013

"The North" is a fairly small region and only a handful of peoples are native to this part of the world. However, many from different races and cultures have been known to visit:

Hitting the books:

From the D20/ZGG Books:
  • Afridhi
  • Peshwah
    • Adiel ("The Horselords")
    • Briela (The Wanderers)
    • Bortai (The Savages)
    • Falleem (Merchants)
    • Irfat (The Black Riders)
    • Leron (Guardians)
    • Ornidri (Archers)
    • Peshneath (Craftsmen)
    • Qulaam (Riverfolk)
    • Somhak (Warlords)
    • Sufz (Spiritualists)
    • Zah (Magic-Users)
  • Skandaharians
  • Tenians (Most are of Thonian stock)
  • Thonians, Common
  • Thonians, High
  • Valemen

Additional groups from the DA modules:
Additional groups from the FFC/Original Campaign:
  • Gypsies (Most likely later rolled into one of the Peshwah Clans - The Briela)
  • Northern Lords (A subgroup of Skandaharians)
  • Barbarians (In this context, likely refers to Peshwah, probably the Bortai)
  • Picts (Later replaced by Orcs or Valemen)
  • Nomads of Ten (Later rolled into one of the Peshwah Clans - The Irfat)
  • "Vikings" (Later Skandaharians)
  • Salikar (Never mentioned as such, but the people of the Gin of Salik, a middle eastern type people?).
  • Rhunians (Likely related to the Skandaharians)
  • "Thralls" (Gor-like slavefolk whose slaves appear in the Duchy of the Peaks. Not to be confused with the Thralls of Coot
  • People of the Peaks (Most likely of Thonian stock, though especially corrupt, decadent and cowardly)

Questions and comments are welcome! Smile

-Havard

Re: Humans of Blackmoor? - Freedom92 - 07-18-2013

Havard Wrote:"The North" is a fairly small region and only a handful of peoples are native to this part of the world. However, many from different races and cultures have been known to visit:

Hitting the books:

From the D20/ZGG Books:
  • Afridhi
  • Peshwah
    • Adiel ("The Horselords")
    • Briela (The Wanderers)
    • Bortai (The Savages)
    • Falleem (Merchants)
    • Irfat (The Black Riders)
    • Leron (Guardians)
    • Ornidri (Archers)
    • Peshneath (Craftsmen)
    • Qulaam (Riverfolk)
    • Somhak (Warlords)
    • Sufz (Spiritualists)
    • Zah (Magic-Users)
  • Skandaharians
  • Tenians (Most are of Thonian stock)
  • Thonians, Common
  • Thonians, High
  • Valemen
Thats a awesome list! Big Grin I would love more info on the Peshwah tribes especially the Sufz, Ifrat, and Zah!
Havard Wrote:Additional groups from the DA modules:
Synobians? Cirkhosian? Any details on those two?
Also Gren has always been in my mind the name for the gamma world greenfolk.
I'm keeping the Kurgan in my game, they make a good communal enemy for the peshwah of their own kin.
Also I liked the few Sollux described, theyre paragons of good and enemies of the few evil elemental beings.
Havard Wrote:Additional groups from the FFC/Original Campaign:
  • Gypsies (Most likely later rolled into one of the Peshwah Clans - The Briela)
  • Northern Lords (A subgroup of Skandaharians)
  • Barbarians (In this context, likely refers to Peshwah, probably the Bortai)
  • Picts (Later replaced by Orcs or Valemen)
  • Nomads of Ten (Later rolled into one of the Peshwah Clans - The Irfat)
  • "Vikings" (Later Skandaharians)
  • Salikar (Never mentioned as such, but the people of the Gin of Salik, a middle eastern type people?).
  • Rhunians (Likely related to the Skandaharians)
  • "Thralls" (Gor-like slavefolk whose slaves appear in the Duchy of the Peaks. Not to be confused with the Thralls of Coot
  • People of the Peaks (Most likely of Thonian stock, though especially corrupt, decadent and cowardly)

Questions and comments are welcome! Smile

-Havard
I think I'll keep the Picts in my game as those who bred with orcs creating a group of debased humans, they have always been depicted as savage debased humans so why not?
Also the Salikar sound interesting to me, the name does have a middle eastern feel to me.
I agree on the Rhunians and Northern Lords being related to the Skandharians but what are their standings? Are the Rhunians more incline to use magic over brawn? Are the Northern Lords any different from the Sea Reavers culture wise? Picture what they deal with on a daily basis, wild magic spawned monsters and cold death.

Re: Humans of Blackmoor? - Havard - 07-18-2013

Freedom92 Wrote:Thats a awesome list! Big Grin I would love more info on the Peshwah tribes especially the Sufz, Ifrat, and Zah!

Thank you my friend!

There is quite a bit of detail on the tribes in the d20 DAB sourcebook, but ZGG also published a book called Riders of Hak which gets into even more detail on them.

Some information I have compiled on the Peshwah on my blog:
Peshwah Tribes
Peshwah History
Peshwah Weapons & Armor


Quote:Synobians? Cirkhosian? Any details on those two?

There is very little detail on them available. Synobians appear to be of a Monastic culture, while the Cirkhosians seem to be traders. I made both groups from regions within the Thonian Empire IMC.


Quote:Also Gren has always been in my mind the name for the gamma world greenfolk.

Not too familiar with Gamma World. What are they like there? Smile


Quote:I'm keeping the Kurgan in my game, they make a good communal enemy for the peshwah of their own kin.

Yeah. I like them that way too. Note also that the Thonians (Empire) sometimes uses Kurgan Lancers as mercenaries.


Quote:Also I liked the few Sollux described, theyre paragons of good and enemies of the few evil elemental beings.

Yeah. IIRC there is a difference between normal Sollux and the Sun Brothers, the latter being the true paragon types.


Quote:I think I'll keep the Picts in my game as those who bred with orcs creating a group of debased humans, they have always been depicted as savage debased humans so why not?

Why not, indeed? Smile

Greg wrote that Dave Arneson decided to replace Picts with Orcs as the group wanted more Tolkieneque elements into the game. In my take on the Valemen, I figured that the Picts could be early ancestors of the Valemen who probably made up the majority of the human population of the North before the Peshwah and Thonians arrived.

Quote:Also the Salikar sound interesting to me, the name does have a middle eastern feel to me.

The country is called Salik (in the FFC), but I made up the term Salikar to describe the people from there. Glad you liked it. The FFC doesnt have too much detail on them, but I am getting an Arabian Nights type wibe off it, with Flying Carpets and stuff like that.



Quote:I agree on the Rhunians and Northern Lords being related to the Skandharians but what are their standings? Are the Rhunians more incline to use magic over brawn? Are the Northern Lords any different from the Sea Reavers culture wise? Picture what they deal with on a daily basis, wild magic spawned monsters and cold death.

Basically, I see the Skandaharians divided into three known groups:
Raiders of the West
Raiders of the East
Northern Lords

What I noticed about the Northern Lords is that they joined Vestfold in the war against the Egg of Coot. I did a more detailed writeup of them here.

The Duchy of Rhun is detailed in the FFC. I see them as more distant relatives of the Skandaharians, living across the Sea to the East. I have a half-written outline of them somewhere based on some ideas from the now gone ZGG forum.

-Havard

Re: Humans of Blackmoor? - Freedom92 - 07-18-2013

In Gamma World the Gren were a race of what looked like green skin humanoids who abandoned technology after the fallout. They were green skinned and similar to elves, my usual take on them was they were post apocalyptic plant people and always had a shadow culture like elves vs. shadow elves. The Gren were strange, alien, and very natural in their primitive technology and mutations that were plant based.

Yeah Sun Brothers were the greater version of the Sollux.

I see then so the picts could be considered the original stock for Valemen and possibly others. I could see those debased Valemen who refused to serve Thonia or any man besides their own and went off into the wild. This is where they met others like them but of the monstrous breed and with this thing in common they became one group breeding in and out.

I would love to delve into Salik some how, might try and think of a way to do that.