gsvenson Wrote:Dave was a history major and interested in India in the 18th and 19th C because of it's place in the relations between Britian and France and later Russia, so I am sure that he read about the NW Frontier as history. He probably read historical fiction on it, too. When he chose sides in a historical game he prefered to play Russians up to the 20th C where he switched his preference to Japanese.

I personally never read Kipling (I have seen the movie), but remember reading at least one novel set on the NW Frontier. It may have been part of a series of stories, because I think I read another novel where the same hero was in the Boar War. I just can't remember the name, Ogalvie or something like that, perhaps.

Was it Flashman? My fellow Brit Colonial wargaming chums mention it, though I've yet to read it myself. :oops:

gsvenson Wrote:No, we had Toska Rusa and the Afridhi as enemies in 1974 give or take a year...

Another gold mine detail! Thanks Greg! I remember you mentioning the Afridhi and Toska Rusa from the original campaign earlier, but now we are able to place it into the chronology.

I wonder if mention of the Battle of Goblin Kush in DA4 could have been a reference to events from the original campaign. Possibly also the Battle of the Neck which IIRC was between Blackmoor and Afridhi.

I suspect that Arneson originally was planning to have the Afridhi march directly towards Blackmoor avoiding the Duchy of Ten, whereas after the release of DA4, Arneson decided to go with Ritchie's decision to have them invade Ten first. ZG went along with the DA4 turn of events based on Arneson's final decision.



-Havard

Ooh its so cool when some new (to me) detail comes out! Can you remember any details about the Aifridi/Toska Rusa from the first campaign Greg?

Where can I find details about this "Toska Rusa"? :oops:

DungeonDevil Wrote:Where can I find details about this "Toska Rusa"? :oops:

DA4 Duchy of Ten. She is known as the Mistress of the god, the god here being Zugzul, main patron of the Afridhi, of which Toska Rusa is queen.

Havard

Thanks, Havard!
I (perhaps hastily) assumed that the later-published modules (DA1-4) were later additions by people other than DA himself and therefore of apocryphal quality. Is my assessment overly skeptical?

Toska Rusa was played by one of the guy's girl friend, but I don't even remember which guy never the less her name. I think she/they were more active in the EPT campaign at Dr Barker's. That may place it in 1975 rather than earlier. I think that is when he got started.

DungeonDevil Wrote:Thanks, Havard!

No problem

Quote:I (perhaps hastily) assumed that the later-published modules (DA1-4) were later additions by people other than DA himself and therefore of apocryphal quality. Is my assessment overly skeptical?

There are different schools of thought on this.

DA1-3 were credited Dave Arneson and Dave Ritchie. While Ritchie surely had an impact on the products, he was clearly working based on notes from Arneson's campaign and consulted Arneson on these modules. DA4 does not credit Arneson, and there were things in that module that Arneson originally did not agree with, but large parts of it are still Arnesonian ideas. I suspect that the main departure from Arneson in DA4 is the fact that the Afridhi conquered the Duchy of Ten, whereas Arneson would rather have had them bypass Ten and attack Blackmoor through the Dismal Swamp.

Arneson may have had even more of a background role in the D20 line, but then again he was co-owner of the company (ZGG) which should mean something.

Personally, I take all sources into account. Arneson always worked with other people when presenting Blackmoor. Even with the FFC he had help from JG and credits a section to Richard Snider as well.

-Havard

gsvenson Wrote:Toska Rusa was played by one of the guy's girl friend, but I don't even remember which guy never the less her name. I think she/they were more active in the EPT campaign at Dr Barker's. That may place it in 1975 rather than earlier. I think that is when he got started.

Interesting. We could ask Jeff Berry about this then.

-Havard

Havard Wrote:

DungeonDevil Wrote:Thanks, Havard!

No problem

Quote:I (perhaps hastily) assumed that the later-published modules (DA1-4) were later additions by people other than DA himself and therefore of apocryphal quality. Is my assessment overly skeptical?

There are different schools of thought on this. ...


Arneson may have had even more of a background role in the D20 line, but then again he was co-owner of the company (ZGG) which should mean something.

I'd argue the opposite. Havard knows more than anybody regarding the overall corpus of Blackmoor, but there is indeed disagreement on Arnesons role on different parts and the DA series being one of them. David Ritchie was the lead writer there and his role was to intergrate Blackmoor into the TSR line as a standard TSR Mystara product. He consulted with Arneson (a little less on each one, seemingly) and worked from his notes, but it was ultimatly TSR who dictated the nature of the line and Ritchie who crafted it. The ZGG line, on the other hand, while largely an invention of the other writers, was under Daves control, at least to the extent that he hadan executive influence and veto power he lacked earlier and the writers were attempting to at least be consistent with Dave's vision.