Blog compares Arneson to Jesus? Oh my... :)

[Havard]

Okay the analogy is a bit over the top for me, but the article is pretty nice. It is also great seeing someone else writing about Dave Arneson. Worth a read.

http://hexcellency.blogspot.no/2016/03/ ... -city.html

-Havard

[Rafael]

The Kentner story is bollocks.

The author "heard" it, yeah? Well, where? - Even under the very restrictive US copyright law, nominative fair use is generally permitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nominative_use


Now, as with other projects, like "The Great Kingdom" documentary, a few years back, he might have to plan the payment of a legal counselor into his budget for the project; if he is unwilling, or unable to do that, then, yes, posturing and scare stories, by whomever spouts them, will surely be enough to intimidate him.

But the story itself, likely complete nonsense. I don't play that card often, but I work in a field where I have to deal with stuff like that quite frequently; not so much because this was a business reality, but because many of my clients believe in this kind of urban myths. And I've said this a couple of times when we here were more involved with Kentner's efforts: I don't know who counsels Kentner at the moment, but he needs way, way more professional support than the people that he seems to have around him right now.

[Thondor]

This is the first I've heard about Dragons in the Basement . . .

And now I am sad that it has not come out yet . . .

[gsvenson]

Interesting article. I pretty much agree with the author's premise, but surprised by the comparison to Jesus and Saint Paul.

Living in Florida, I was too far away to get interviewed for "Dragons in the Basement" back about 10 years ago when they did the interviews. I remember Dave A. saying he was having trouble getting Kentner to finish the project.

[Thondor]

The analogy seemed surprisingly apt. This part stuck out to me:

Dave was spontaneous. Gary was an organized writer and worker. Without Dave, Gary couldn’t have written Dungeons & Dragons, or any role-playing game for that matter. Without Gary, Dave’s clever invention couldn’t have made it out of his circle of friends. Both geniuses were needed to really accomplish what was accomplished.

That unofficial / unpopular “sect” can be equated to Arneson’s original Blackmoor campaign. Publication of the OD&D White Box can be equated to Saint Paul’s Epistles.

It's sad to here that something like Dungeons in the Basement this has languished for so long. Would have been very interesting to hear every talk about the origin of the game, including you gsvenson.

[finarvyn]

Yes, it's sad that mainstream interest in the development of OD&D took so long to become so popular because the longer we wait the harder it is to unearth the actual events or first-hand accounts. Thank goodness that guys like Jon Peterson have the resources to make a serious study of the subject.

Dunno how Dave should compare to Jesus, but I will say that in the few conversations I had with him I was amazed at his creativity and enthusiasm. The only game designer I can think of who might have compared to Dave was Erick Wujcik, and Erick had a hard time getting his ideas organized and published, too. (Not to take anything from Gary, you understand; we all know what Gary contributed to the hobby.)

[Havard]

Hi Thondor, great seeing you here again!

The analogy seemed surprisingly apt. This part stuck out to me:

Dave was spontaneous. Gary was an organized writer and worker. Without Dave, Gary couldn’t have written Dungeons & Dragons, or any role-playing game for that matter. Without Gary, Dave’s clever invention couldn’t have made it out of his circle of friends. Both geniuses were needed to really accomplish what was accomplished.

That unofficial / unpopular “sect” can be equated to Arneson’s original Blackmoor campaign. Publication of the OD&D White Box can be equated to Saint Paul’s Epistles.

It's sad to here that something like Dungeons in the Basement this has languished for so long. Would have been very interesting to hear every talk about the origin of the game, including you gsvenson.

I think there could be something to that. Gary and Dave certainly brought different things to the table and the combination of that was what became D&D. However, I think that such a simplification can also be misleading. When Mark Hammil was asked if he agreed that George Lucas was not an actor's director he said he did not like this comparison simply because you cannot boil anyone's abilties down to a single sentence. I think the same applies to Gary and Dave.

Other factors are as important. Dave was 10 years younger that Gary. In 1974 Gary already had experience in publishing games, running gaming organizations and organizing conventions. Dave on the other hand had a background of running massive Napoleon Era War Gaming (Napoleonics) as well as his experience of thinking outside the box when it came to gaming based in ideas from Wesely and the Minnesota Gamers as well as his own highly creative mind.

As to Kentner's Documentary, my understanding is that Dragons in the Basement was about Dave interviewing different people in the industry about the roots of the hobby. At this point, I wish the footage had been interviews with Dave himself instead of the other way around. I suspect that the footage might not be of the best quality. That is not to say it could not be turned into a very interesting documentary, but it might require alot more work than simply editing the footage together in a viewable manner.

It would be awesome to see this come to life, but I see no reason to call Kentner out for not having been able to compile this yet. From what I understand he is an amateur in this field and mainly a fan, and he is in no way obligated to do this any more than any other fan, unless there was some kind of agreement between him and Dave.

I know that Dave wanted his story to be told, but I think we are doing a pretty good job about that here on this website. Everyone's contributions here are very valuable in this respect

-Havard

[Rafael]

I share that sentiment; I am myself guilty of making rather flamboyant announcements, here and there. In this case, though, as with a series of documentaries on early D&D, hiring an external - and professional - producer would be the key, to end what seems to boil down to procedural difficulties, and apparent procrastination.

I live in Germany, and so am out of the question for such a job, but any even half-competent content manager/media consultant can work wonders with such material - wonders that monetarize pretty easily, if that's the principal interest, as well.