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Dave Arneson on the Empire of Izmer
#1
Knightfall just posted on the Piazza the following correspondence between himself and Dave Arneson from 2002 on Izmer, the setting of the first D&D movie, on which Arneson worked. Within these emails there are also hidden quite a bit of insight on Blackmoor:



Knightfall Wrote:I think it would be okay to share some e-mails I exchanged with Dave regarding Izmer...

From: Robert Blezard [rblezard@...]
Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 6:17 PM
To: darneson3@...
Cc: Arneson, David
Subject: From my Web Site

Hi Dave,

I have some questions for you regarding the Empire of Izmer and its characters. Mainly, I want to find out if the Empire was originally from Courtney's homebrew campaign world or if he just made it up for the movie. Does he have a website for his company or personally?

The reason I'm asking this is because I'm in the process of adapting Izmer to fit into my campaign world. I've got all the info and PDF downloads from WotC's site but I'm clamoring for more. I bought the novelization, as well as the movie.

Attached is a JPG map of what is going to be my Izmer with place named from the movie and novel. (Note: Izmer is only going to be a kingdom in my campaign that was once part of a larger empire.)

Were official maps of Izmer, Sumdall and/or Antius City ever done or can you even discuss that? I have a lot of burning questions but don't want to go into all of them unless your willing.

Cheers!

Robert Blezard
Edmonton, Alberta
Canada

Quote:From: Arneson, David
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2002 7:16 AM
To: Robert Blezard
Subject: RE: From my Web Site

Dear Robert,

Although at least partially based on Corey's world Izmer was pretty much made up for the movie. How much so I do not know for sure.

The characters in the movie were all done for the movie.

Corey has no websites.

WOTC downloads are fairly inaccurate. I should know since I was chosen by Corey to do the module after WOTC flubbed it.

Since I did all that work, and WOTC scrubbed movie support (Before the movie came out BTW) I added it to my campaign world.

In my case I placed the Empire beyond the Great Mountains to the West of the Afridi (I.e. REAL far away.) How viable an empire it is I have left open to question. After all just because the Mages think that they are so great does not make it so. And the Dragon Rods do not have unlimited range after all.

Izmer is pretty much done. Based on Prague, Czech. A wonderful old city that has survived intact. I really really like the place.

Antius is partially done but far from complete. The 'Tower' Castles are really a cool idea. Izmer it self is sketchy.

I hope to include all this as a supplement to the Blackmoor source book (out next year).

Last that I heard I can talk about the world and characters for the most part. A few things are 'Secret' but not much.

Respectfully,

Dave Arneson


****

Knightfall Wrote:From: Robert Blezard [rblezard@...]
Sent: Sunday, September 29, 2002 1:40 PM
To: Arneson, David
Subject: Re: From my Web Site



I hope to include all this as a supplement to the Blackmoor source book (out next year).

Cool. Looking forward to it. But does that mean that the main Blackmoor source book will be out in 2003 and then the Izmer supplement later that year or in 2004?

I'll have to see if I can find an online map of Prague somewhere. And the tower castles of Antius are indeed a really cool idea. I tried putting together my own map of Antius but it doesn't look right.

Last that I heard I can talk about the world and characters for the most part. A few things are 'Secret' but not much.

Alright, down to the nitty gritty then. The most important thing I'm looking for are the appropriate levels for these main characters - Ridley, Marina, Savina, Elwood, Norda, and your Charlie the Cutpurse character. (Since you said the downloads are inaccurate.) I'm setting my Izmer five years after the movie using the ending in the novel, which means I'm planning to advance these characters in level. I really like Damodar's character too and will most likely resurrect him later on. Snails may or may not come back in my Izmer and if Profion does return it will be as a lich or some other powerful type of undead (or maybe even an evil Outsider). Both Vildan and Azmath (died in novel, not sure about in the movie) are going to stay dead in my version. I'll probably promote Marina to the head of the School of Magic, much to the chagrin of several other prominent wizards that were jockeying to become the next School Master.

BTW, I've attached an advanced character draft of Savina, as she will fit into my world, in Doc format and would like your opinion. (I created it using Jamis Buck's online character generator. I love that tool.) Unfortunately, I didn't have anything to go on as the On Location in the Imperial Capital page on WotC's site doesn't list a level for her.

Next Question. Is Norda a half-elf or an elf? She refers to herself as being over two and fifty years old in the movie, which is a little out of whack for a half-elf. Of course, she could have just been playing with Snails mind in order to get him to back off. Heh.

Next Question. What exactly is the Way? Is it like being a sorcerer, a psion or something else entirely? This ones important because on the continent I'm placing Izmer, called Harqual, there is already an aspect of needing a Balance between magic and the natural world built into my campaign design. (Thus, Izmer fits right in.) In my world, dragons are, for the most part, neutral in alignment (LN, NG, N, NE, CN). They are protectors of the Balance for the over goddess, Mirella, and work with her clerics, druids, and a special order of warriors known as the Knights Majestic (no PrC yet). Other dragons that don't live within the Balance are considered 'rouge', even if they are LG or CG. It's the job of the Knights Majestic to either bring them back into the fold, Balance-wise, or eliminate them from Harqual (i.e. death, banishment).

Next Question. Marina is obviously from somewhere called Pretensa but is that a city, town, or a region? I'm thinking it's a city but I want to be sure. Any other cities, towns, villages that you can tell me about. The novel refers to Gonnetz Town and names the tribe of elves, Verdalf. Is Verdalf the name of their tree community too, or did Mr. Barrett simply make up these names for the novel?

Next Question. (Let me know if I'm going overboard.) What are the dominate terrains of Izmer? Is Izmer mainly plains and cleared farmland or is it rolling hills and forest? I know that this question is a little obscure but my inquiring mind would like to know.

Quote:From: Arneson, David
Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 3:39 PM
To: Robert Blezard
Cc: darneson3@aol.com
Subject: RE: From my Web Site



[color=##40BFFF]I hope to include all this as a supplement to the Blackmoor source book (out next year).[/color]

Cool. Looking forward to it. But does that mean that the main Blackmoor source book will be out in 2003 and then the Izmer supplement later that year or in 2004? [color=##40BFFF]Probably be a part of the late 2003 titles.[/color]

I'll have to see if I can find an online map of Prague somewhere. And the tower castles of Antius are indeed a really cool idea. I tried putting together my own map of Antius but it doesn't look right. The Tower castles are over 1,000 years old. Caused when the Dwarven mines there collapsed. Magic provided the 'Foundations' for the new castles. The castles themselves are nothing special. Access is via Rope elevators, etc. plus magic portals. Download the picture of Antius at the web site and fake it!

Last that I heard I can talk about the world and characters for the most part. A few things are 'Secret' but not much.


Alright, down to the nitty gritty then. The most important thing I'm looking for are the appropriate levels for these main characters - Ridley, Marina, Savina, Elwood, Norda, and your Charlie the Cutpurse character. (Since you said the downloads are inaccurate.) I'm setting my Izmer five years after the movie using the ending in the novel, which means I'm planning to advance these characters in level. I really like Damodar's character too and will most likely resurrect him later on [Arneson, David] Yeah I liked him too. He is a mage so a Saving Throw could be rtationalized. Snails [Arneson, David] (He is supposed too.) may or may not come back in my Izmer and if Profion does return it will be as a lich [Arneson, David] (Most probable.) or some other powerful type of undead (or maybe even an evil Outsider). [Arneson, David] Unlikely. Both Vildan and Azmath (died in novel, not sure about in the movie) are going to stay dead in my version. I'll probably promote Marina to the head of the School of Magic, [Arneson, David] Unlikely.) much to the chagrin of several other prominent wizards that were jockeying to become the next School Master.



Next Question. Is Norda a half-elf or an elf? [Arneson, David] (Half-Elf) refers to herself as being over two and fifty years old in the movie, which is a little out of whack for a half-elf. [Arneson, David] (Not in this world!) Of course, she could have just been playing with Snails mind [Arneson, David] (Likely!) in order to get him to back off. Heh.

Next Question. What exactly is the Way? Is it like being a sorcerer, a psion or something else entirely? This ones important because on the continent I'm placing Izmer, called Harqual, there is already an aspect of needing a Balance between magic and the natural world built into my campaign design. (Thus, Izmer fits right in.) In my world, dragons are, for the most part, neutral in alignment (LN, NG, N, NE, CN). They are protectors of the Balance for the over goddess, Mirella, and work with her clerics, druids, and a special order of warriors known as the Knights Majestic (no PrC yet). Other dragons that don't live within the Balance are considered 'rogue', even if they are LG or CG. It's the job of the
Knights Majestic to either bring them back into the fold, Balance-wise, or eliminate them from Harqual (i.e. death, banishment). [Arneson, David] (OK. That should work.)

Next Question. Marina is obviously from somewhere called Pretensa but is that a city, town, or a region? [Arneson, David] (City and Region) I'm thinking it's a city but I want to be sure. Any other cities, towns, villages that you can tell me about. The novel refers to Gonnetz Town and names the tribe of elves, Verdalf. Is Verdalf the name of their tree community too, or did Mr.Barrett simply make up these names for the novel? [Arneson, David] (Barrett did make them up. The Elves are HUNTER Elves. Much more concerned with the 'Balance' and not reluctant to intervene in affairs to set them 'right'. They like to pretend that they are aloof from such things. The later is my take on them BTW.)

Next Question. (Let me know if I'm going overboard.) What are the dominate terrains of Izmer? Is Izmer mainly plains and cleared farmland or is it rolling hills and forest? I know that this question is a little obscure but my inquiring mind would like to know. [Arneson, David] Pretty much just like Czech. A little bit of everything, including a seacoast (Big Lake ??)

***

Knightfall Wrote:From: Robert Blezard [rblezard@...]
Sent: Monday, September 30, 2002 8:10 PM
To: Arneson, David
Subject: Re: Re: From my Web Site

[Arneson, David] The Elves are HUNTER Elves. Much more concerned with the 'Balance' and not reluctant to intervene in affairs to set them 'right'. They like to pretend that they are aloof from such things.

So are Hunter Elves more like sylvan/wild elves or high/gray elves?

And two last questions. What is the name of Three-Eyes race? And are there any other new races in Izmer?

Cheers!

Robert

Quote:From: Arneson, David
Sent: Monday, September 30, 2002 12:25 PM
To: Robert Blezard
Subject: RE: Re: From my Web Site

Robert,

Corey's Elves bear more resemblance to Blackmoor's Mountain Elves (West of the Duchy of Tehnn). They are basically a blending of High Elves and Wild Elves. More Emphasis on the 'Wild' when dealing with humans and 'High" when dealing with each other. They try to maintain a 'Low' magical profile to keep the mages comfortable. Otherwise there would be open war.

Three Eyes race has not name. We called them Tri-Clops among ourselves for the module. They are a race with very strong mental powers.

There were to be almost a dozen new races until the special effects budget went south. Hopes that New Line would extend the funding proved to be a pipe dream.

Me, I don't mind answering questions. Too bad that the web site went away. I hope to add such a section to my own web site. Right now I am seeking permission from Corey.

Respectfully,

Dave Arneson

Source and additional information: http://www.thepiazza.org.uk/bb/viewtopi ... 307#p84307

-Havard
Currently Running: The Blackmoor Vales Saga
Currently Playing: Daniel S. Debelfry in the Throne of Star's Campaign
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#2
Exceptional find. Smile
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#3
Indeed!

BTW I edited the original post changing the color of Arneson's font for easier readability on this forum.

Anyway, here are some things I would like to highlight:

Dave Arneson Wrote:In my case I placed the Empire beyond the Great Mountains to the West of the Afridi (I.e. REAL far away.)


This is the first time I have heard Arneson mention The Great Mountains and his ideas for lands beyond the Afridhi.

I think it was a good idea for ZG to drop the incorporation of Izmir into Blackmoor, especially given the reactions to the D&D movie, but also since it would have been a part of the setting that did not originate with Arneson.

My own idea was to incorporate Izmer as an historical version of Alphatia in the Mystara campaign, but in spite of Solomon probably getting his ideas from an old Mystara campaign, this was not embraced by the Mystara community given the general feeling about the movie among D&D fans.

Quote:(Barrett did make them up. The Elves are HUNTER Elves. Much more concerned with the 'Balance' and not reluctant to intervene in affairs to set them 'right'. They like to pretend that they are aloof from such things. The later is my take on them BTW.)



Corey's Elves bear more resemblance to Blackmoor's Mountain Elves (West of the Duchy of Tehnn). They are basically a blending of High Elves and Wild Elves. More Emphasis on the 'Wild' when dealing with humans and 'High" when dealing with each other. They try to maintain a 'Low' magical profile to keep the mages comfortable. Otherwise there would be open war.


While he is talking about the movie, this is also an interesting description of how Arneson viewed the Westryn (unless he is talking about an entirely different elven race?) two years before the D20 Blackmoor CS was published. I have never heard them described as mountain elves before, but the wild part certainly fits.


Quote:Three Eyes race has not name. We called them Tri-Clops among ourselves for the module. They are a race with very strong mental powers.

There were to be almost a dozen new races until the special effects budget went south. Hopes that New Line would extend the funding proved to be a pipe dream.


Although this race was probably invented by Courtney (Corey) Solomon or someone else involved with the movie, I am tempted to include them into Blackmoor. They are a purple skinned race with a third eye located on their forehead. (Something for your campaign Rafe?)Tri-Clops is of course a name from the Masters of the Universe series, so I wouldn't use that name in the game.

Quote:Me, I don't mind answering questions. Too bad that the web site went away. I hope to add such a section to my own web site. Right now I am seeking permission from Corey.

I am a little touched by Arneson's enthusiasm for this project. It seems like he is really happy about getting to work with D&D again, in spite of how the movie flopped. This enthusiasm seems to have been channeled onto Blackmoor again (never far from his thoughts, it seems) once ZG got the ball rolling in 2004.

-Havard
Currently Running: The Blackmoor Vales Saga
Currently Playing: Daniel S. Debelfry in the Throne of Star's Campaign
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#4
I have already taken out my notebook for "The Promised Land", and am taking notes.

I doubt we will *see* this place, but a few references here and there might fit in,
especially in the chapters where we deviate a bit from usual canon... Smile


Also, I am earnestly putting together some notes for a project I TOLD YOU ABOUT AND STILL AWAIT YOUR ANSWER MAIL. :wink:

Stuff like this is what I had been looking for. Smile



BTW, in case you wonder, Mondays are my free days in general, this is while I'm flooding the web with, errh, my pearls of wisdom.

Edit: Bad language removed by Havard Wink
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#5
Confusedhock: Confusedhock: Confusedhock: Confusedhock: Confusedhock:

Now I have to change my map again!!!

I thought Arneson's only connection to that movie was being flown in for a six second scene where he played one of several casting wizards. I had no idea he was working on a module and apparently in regular correspondence with one of the film makers.

As to incorporatieng things "corey" invented - I don't have any issues with that provided they were endorsed by Dave. Indeed a great deal of Blackmoor was made up by, well all sorts of people/players. As long as Dave expressed enthusiasm for it and tried to work it in, I'm all for it.

This is really cool. I barely remember that movie though - it was truly poor film making - but I wouldn't hold that against the setting.
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#6
The movie was quite horrible, but reading through this files give us more information about how Arneson's creative mind works. Of course his work was building on the framework created by Courtney Solomon, but in the details we find ideas that are very Arnesonian.

-Havard
Currently Running: The Blackmoor Vales Saga
Currently Playing: Daniel S. Debelfry in the Throne of Star's Campaign
Reply
#7
Big Mac posted a pretty useful thread on the Piazza collecting links and downloads for this setting:

http://www.thepiazza.org.uk/bb/viewtopi ... 307#p96307

-Havard
Currently Running: The Blackmoor Vales Saga
Currently Playing: Daniel S. Debelfry in the Throne of Star's Campaign
Reply
#8
I've given some thought to using Izmer in place of Alphatia in a Known World (not exactly, Mystara) game.
Reply
#9
Combatmedic Wrote:I've given some thought to using Izmer in place of Alphatia in a Known World (not exactly, Mystara) game.

This is not far from what I was thinking about. Its not a far stretch given that Courtney Solomon based Izmer on Alphatia anyway. I wanted to accomodate both movies, so I suggested that the events depicted in the movie took place around AC900 in the Mystara calendar, which would mean that Damodar would be released from his imprisonment some time after WotI.

Granted, this suggestion has not been met with much enthusiasm from other fans. Understandable given the quality of the movie.

Since my Blackmoor campaign is set in Mystara's past, I retain some connection between Izmer and Blackmoor, although the Izmer/Alphatia region is little more than a barbaric continent, which has seen some Skandaharian exploration at the moment. I have thought about having the imprisonment of the Dragon God (From Wrath of the Dragon God) happen in the Blackmoor Era. Probably I will use Chamber/Watchworks in place of Faluzure. If he was imprisoned in the mountains of Bellisaria during the Blackmoor Beastman Crusades I could see some interesting adventure opportunities.


-Havard
Currently Running: The Blackmoor Vales Saga
Currently Playing: Daniel S. Debelfry in the Throne of Star's Campaign
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#10
Aaaaaaah, this was the thread I was looking for.
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